Weapon element

Originally posted by malufett
can you elaborate further by giving examples thanks...

do mean by stat atk is atk from bare hands?

Originally posted by Ikari Gendo
e.g. you should hit the emperium with aspersion because the stat atk still hits
stat atk is the atk from str/dex and base lvl

Edited by Ikari Gendo, 30 June 2012 - 02:29 PM.

Originally posted by Reapeddeamon
I guess the are referending to:
http://irowiki.org/w..._ATK#Status_ATK

Originally posted by malufett

e.g. you should hit the emperium with aspersion because the stat atk still hits

You can only hit Emperium if and only if GVG/WOE is on, you have sufficient guild skill & level...

and Asperio's effect will be remove if you remove your weapon and it does not work in bare hands

hmm..sorry but still it is not clear enough for me...

Originally posted by Reapeddeamon
We got WoE on our server and some priest was buffing a frenzy RK asperio wich changes his atk to holy so he was hitting the emp which is holy element with a holy weapon and was missing what seem legit  to us cause of ele reduction holy does 0% on holy but if the forumulas that are given from irowiki are correct then not he complete Atk is force to holy the statsATK part would be remain neutral that the Rk would be able to hitting to emp still if he has a holy weapon.

Originally posted by malufett
hmm..now I get it...

and this is how it works when you are using a weapon your status atk is computed along with the weapon atk so the damage your dealing is now watk..

ill give you a real time example..

example you are using a flaming sword then you will try to hit a fire do you think if the sword misses the fire will you use your hand to hit the fire while holding the sword?? I don't think so..XD

hope you get it..^^

Originally posted by Roth
Don't be stupid in comparing the stuff to reality.

In official servers, notably in iRO, status attack is neutral, and Mind Wind (taekwon skill) is the only skill that changes its element. Endows and Aspersio only affect weapon attack.

So it's basically

[status atk: neutral] + [weapon atk: variable] = your attack damage.

Edited by Roth, 30 June 2012 - 03:22 PM.

Originally posted by Reapeddeamon
Malufett if u see that so u should be able to hit a holy mob with bare hands even if u have an holy endow ...

but that is even not given...

Edited by Reapeddeamon, 30 June 2012 - 03:32 PM.

Originally posted by malufett

Don't be stupid in comparing the stuff to reality.

In official servers, notably in iRO, status attack is neutral, and Mind Wind (taekwon skill) is the only skill that changes its element. Endows and Aspersio only affect weapon attack.

So it's basically

[status atk: neutral] + [weapon atk: variable] = your attack damage.

yes I know but that is how it works...

Malufett if u see that so u should be able to hit a holy mob with bare hands even if u have an holy endow ...

but that is even not given...

this is more appealing to me as a bug...

Originally posted by Reapeddeamon

this is more appealing to me as a bug...

Originally posted by malufett
wew...you two make my nose bleed...hahaha..

if you just said to us that the weapon endowing skills/items is affecting bare hands where it should not...then it makes  our life easier...XD

anyway..I confirmed this....

@Ikari Gendo
please confirm if Reapeddeamon is telling us the way you are thinking...because I'm really confuse on your statements...

Originally posted by Ikari Gendo
no my statment was that the stat atk (neutral ele) still hit if you attack a monster with holy armor with a holy weapon

Originally posted by malufett
hmmm...ok correct me if I am wrong

me(using holy weapon or endowed with holy)  + me attack monster w/ holy attribute = can damage to the monster but only my status attack deals damage to monster

if this is that you are talking about....I checked it with the latest svn but unlucky I can't reproduce it...^^

Originally posted by Ikari Gendo
to state it clear: can you hit the emperium (holy) with a weapon which has been endowed holy by aspersio

Originally posted by MarkZD

to state it clear: can you hit the emperium (holy) with a weapon which has been endowed holy by aspersio

According to Renewal sources you can since part of your atk is status atk which is not affected by element(except for Mild Wind), in this case it'll always be neutral regardless the endow you're using.

Renewal atk, matk, def(if I'm not wrong) and mdef are not implemented yet, this is the possible reason it's not working as it should.

I assume you are talking about renewal ATK here. The formula currently employed is indeed far from correct. Research on that subject is ongoing, but I expect it will be a while before we get it done.

http://rathena.org/b...atk-calculation

http://rathena.org/b...f-formula-issue

http://rathena.org/b...se-final-damage

http://rathena.org/b...ame-system-matk

http://rathena.org/b...enewal-defense/

Edited by MarkZD, 30 June 2012 - 11:44 PM.

Originally posted by Jhedzkie
try using mysteltain weapon and use aspersio. try to hit the emp on woe, when it hits, then weapon property stays as is. since mysteltain is shadow if im not mistaken, it wont miss on emp. however when it missed, means the enchanted holy property to the weapon overrides the weapon property itself. meaning, it would have the attack of the char (stat attack) + weapon atk (mysteltain, that changed from shadow, to holy since you used aspersio).

((char base attack (which is neutral) + weapon attack (which is shadow)) * holy property) vs Emp (holy)
therefore holy vs holy = miss.

if im saying irrelevant stuff, just ignore what i said. but this is how i understand what you guys are discussing.

Originally posted by malufett
@Jhedzkie
that is what I'm also thinking and understand...

to state it clear: can you hit the emperium (holy) with a weapon which has been endowed holy by aspersio

BTW are you using post damage modifier skill? like enchant blade cause this one is not modifiable by endows since it is force neutral and it is added after the def reduction and elemental modification...

Originally posted by MarkZD

@Jhedzkiethat is what I'm also thinking and understand...

It doesn't seem to be this way anymore, otherwise it'd be stated it's affected by endow element as it's stated to wATK, eATK.

Also, this would not be in there:

Normally Neutral except when using Mild Wind.

Also, sATK is not reduced by:

• Ignores element resistance effects such as Raydric Card or Asprika.
• Ignores % ATK item effects such as The Sign or Hydra Card.

In this case, it's more like each attack is calculated separately and in the end it's added all together or something like that.

Following this logic: 100% resistance against an element would not prevent from beeing physical-hitted as well as it will still hit emperium even with holy endowed weapon.

About 1 minute. How do you want protect emp by using it if every hit on emperium deals 1 damage?

Level2 insignias are 'forced endow' so the attacker weapon will be have element depending on the insignia used. And only neutral can damage emp ryt?Emp should still be holy. So when attacking with holy element, you would miss (prerenewal). But thanks to RE, there'll "always" be a part of neutral damage, even if you could inflict holy endow.

http://forums.irowik...hp/t-80295.html

Originally posted by malufett
finally someone makes this thing clear...

ok after I evaluate the RE ATK formula yes you are right...

final damage = [ modified base atk + modified weapon atk +- variace atk]

so regardless the value of calculated weapon atk the base atk still hit..

however this will be fixed soon as Wilcard workig for it...

thanks MarkZD problem solved!

Originally posted by Angezerus
Uhm... don't forget equipment attack

ATK = sATK * 2 + wATK + eATK + masteries

STATUS ATK = floor ( Base level / 4 + STR + DEX / 5 + LUK / 3)

• Normally Neutral except when using Mild Wind.
• Ignores element resistance effects such as Raydric Card or Asprika.
• Ignores % ATK item effects such as The Sign or Hydra Card.

Weapon ATK = (Base Weapon ATK + Variance + STR + Bonus Refinement Bonus) * Size Penalty

Variance = ± 0.05 * Weapon Level * Base Weapon ATK

STR Bonus = Base Weapon ATK * STR/200

• Affected by weapon element when using a melee weapon.
• Affected by ammunition element when using a ranged weapon or specific skill.
• Affected by element resistance effects such as Raydric Card or Asprika.
• Increased by % ATK item effects such as The Sign or Hydra Card.
• Multiplied by 5 when affected by Enchant Deadly Poison .
• Though the STR bonus takes Element , it is still considered Neutral .
• STR Bonus is always reduced by Ghost armor.
• STR Bonus is only reduced by Neutral resistance like Raydric card, if the weapon is Neutral too.
• Variance is a random number ranging from (-5% * Weapon Level * Base Weapon ATK) to (5% * Weapon Level * Base Weapon ATK)

Equipment ATK is the sum of ATK gained from equips other than weapons. Support buffs tend to increase this ATK, too, but not all of them fit into this category.

• Affected by weapon element when using a melee weapon.
• Affected by ammunition element when using a ranged weapon or specific skill.
• Ammunition ATK is added here when using DEX based weapon.
• Any +ATK you get from cards, including cards in weapon, is added here.
• Affected by element resistance effects like Raydric Card or Asprika.
• Increased by % ATK item effects like The Sign and Hydra Card.
• Multiplied by 4 when affected by Enchant Deadly Poison.

Mastery ATK is a special kind of ATK that has no elemental properties. While most masteries come from Passive Skills , there are some Active Skills such as Camouflage or Zen.

• Because masteries are not elemental, they are unaffected by Ghost armors or Raydric Cards.
• Since masteries are direct increases to ATK, they are affected by skill modifiers, DEF and damage increasing/decreasing effects.

Edited by Angezerus, 05 July 2012 - 08:05 AM.